I have some relatively ugly grass mixed with my dwarf fescue. The ugly
grass isn't crabgrass, because it just laughs at crabgrass killer. Blades
get fairly wide -- 1/4 to 3/8 inches, and it grows in haphazard directions.
It grows fairly tall. I wish I could identify it, but I'm not that
knowledgeable.

I have been sparying it with Roundup, then planting new seed. However,
my wife is yelling at me for doing that because the brown dying grass is
uglier than the green, ugly grass. Besides, it seems to be a never-ending
project because as I kill off the worst of the bad grass, I get more and
more particular about what "good" grass should look like.

I have 2 questions::
1) What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I am
thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --
especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
better than the ugly grass, which is taller. That way, I wouldn't have to
work so hard, and my wife would yell at me less. Would it work?

2) Although my description of the ugly grass is kind of sketchy, can
anyone take a stab at identifying it? Perhaps there is a selective poison
for it.

Gary Burton

" What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I
am
thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --

especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
better than the ugly grass, which is taller. "

That's unlikely to work. You have some kind of coarse, faster growing
grass. A slow growing dwarf fescue isn't likely to be able to drive
that out. I'd take a sample of it to an agricultural extension service
that many states have. If you can identify it, there may be an agent
that can selectively eliminate it. Otherwise, if you have a lot of it,
I'd use Roundup to whack the bad areas all at once, then over seed the
whole lawn. If it really is everywhere, and there is nothing that will
selectively treat it, then you may need to whackthe whole lawn

G Burton wrote:

> I have some relatively ugly grass mixed with my dwarf fescue. The ugly
> grass isn't crabgrass, because it just laughs at crabgrass killer. Blades
> get fairly wide -- 1/4 to 3/8 inches, and it grows in haphazard directions.
> It grows fairly tall. I wish I could identify it, but I'm not that
> knowledgeable.
>
> I have been sparying it with Roundup, then planting new seed. However,
> my wife is yelling at me for doing that because the brown dying grass is
> uglier than the green, ugly grass. Besides, it seems to be a never-ending
> project because as I kill off the worst of the bad grass, I get more and
> more particular about what "good" grass should look like.
>
> I have 2 questions::
> 1) What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
> like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I am
> thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --
> especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
> better than the ugly grass, which is taller. That way, I wouldn't have to
> work so hard, and my wife would yell at me less. Would it work?
>
> 2) Although my description of the ugly grass is kind of sketchy, can
> anyone take a stab at identifying it? Perhaps there is a selective poison
> for it.
>
> Gary Burton
>
>

It sounds like nutsedge (also called nutgrass). If the blades look
something like monkey grass (mondo grass) but somewhat smaller and
usually come up in three blade shoots in mid-summer then it is probably
nutsedge. Nutsedge will normally grow significantly faster than any
fescue so that halfway between your normal mowing interval you have
perhaps 4 to 6 inch blades towing over your slower growing fescue.
There is a product called Manage that does an excellent job of
controlling this weed grass. Mix per directions and wait until about 4
days after you mow (long enough to give the nutsedge time to grow much
taller than your fescue). Use a pump up sprayer and add a "sticker" (a
type of detergent that breaks the surface tension of the water and makes
it coat the leaves more effectively). I normally use a table spoon of
High Yield Sticker (High Yield is a brand) in a gallon of water with a 1
gallon packet of Manage. Coat the nutsedge leave throughly but do not
drench the dwarf fescue around it too much. If you get a lot of Manage
on your fescue it will brown it out (but it will normally come back).

Good luck

BTW, here are some pictures of various kinds of nutsedge:

http://weeds.ippc.orst.edu/pnw/weeds?weeds/id/Yellow_nutsedg e--Cyperus_esculentus--s.html

http://www.oisat.org/pests/weeds/sedges/nutsedge.html

http://www.agf.gov.bc.ca/cropprot/weedguid/purplent.htm

http://weeds.ippc.orst.edu/pnw/weeds?weeds/id/Purple_nutsedg e--Cyperus_rotundus--m.html

I fear you might be right, but I not willing to whack the whole lawn at
this time.

I actually went to the agricultural station some time and they couldn't
identify the grass. They said they could only identify it by the seed head,
and I didn't bring that in. I may have to get me a seed head and go back,
but they did tell me that selective poisons for grasses don't work very
well. I guess crabgrass is one of the rare exceptions to that.

<trader4 [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
news:1126406102.711207.180160 [at] f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>" What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
> like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I
> am
> thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --
>
> especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
> better than the ugly grass, which is taller. "
>
> That's unlikely to work. You have some kind of coarse, faster growing
> grass. A slow growing dwarf fescue isn't likely to be able to drive
> that out. I'd take a sample of it to an agricultural extension service
> that many states have. If you can identify it, there may be an agent
> that can selectively eliminate it. Otherwise, if you have a lot of it,
> I'd use Roundup to whack the bad areas all at once, then over seed the
> whole lawn. If it really is everywhere, and there is nothing that will
> selectively treat it, then you may need to whackthe whole lawn
>

G Burton wrote:

> I fear you might be right, but I not willing to whack the whole lawn at
> this time.
>
> I actually went to the agricultural station some time and they couldn't
> identify the grass. They said they could only identify it by the seed head,
> and I didn't bring that in. I may have to get me a seed head and go back,
> but they did tell me that selective poisons for grasses don't work very
> well. I guess crabgrass is one of the rare exceptions to that.
>
> <trader4 [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:1126406102.711207.180160 [at] f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
>>" What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
>>like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I
>>am
>>thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --
>>
>>especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
>>better than the ugly grass, which is taller. "
>>
>>That's unlikely to work. You have some kind of coarse, faster growing
>>grass. A slow growing dwarf fescue isn't likely to be able to drive
>>that out. I'd take a sample of it to an agricultural extension service
>>that many states have. If you can identify it, there may be an agent
>>that can selectively eliminate it. Otherwise, if you have a lot of it,
>>I'd use Roundup to whack the bad areas all at once, then over seed the
>>whole lawn. If it really is everywhere, and there is nothing that will
>>selectively treat it, then you may need to whackthe whole lawn
>>
>
>

Maybe I wasn't clear. Manage will control nutsedge with little or no
damage to your fescue.

Thank you!!

I can't tell from the pictures if I have Nutsedge or not. I will wait
until I get a seedhead and take it to my nursery.

"John Crichton" <crichton [at] moya.org> wrote in message
news:2iOUe.321937$x96.167420 [at] attbi_s72...
>G Burton wrote:
>
>> I have some relatively ugly grass mixed with my dwarf fescue. The
>> ugly grass isn't crabgrass, because it just laughs at crabgrass killer.
>> Blades get fairly wide -- 1/4 to 3/8 inches, and it grows in haphazard
>> directions. It grows fairly tall. I wish I could identify it, but I'm
>> not that knowledgeable.
>>
>> I have been sparying it with Roundup, then planting new seed.
>> However, my wife is yelling at me for doing that because the brown dying
>> grass is uglier than the green, ugly grass. Besides, it seems to be a
>> never-ending project because as I kill off the worst of the bad grass, I
>> get more and more particular about what "good" grass should look like.
>>
>> I have 2 questions::
>> 1) What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
>> like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I
>> am thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --
>> especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
>> better than the ugly grass, which is taller. That way, I wouldn't have
>> to work so hard, and my wife would yell at me less. Would it work?
>>
>> 2) Although my description of the ugly grass is kind of sketchy,
>> can anyone take a stab at identifying it? Perhaps there is a selective
>> poison for it.
>>
>> Gary Burton
>
> It sounds like nutsedge (also called nutgrass). If the blades look
> something like monkey grass (mondo grass) but somewhat smaller and usually
> come up in three blade shoots in mid-summer then it is probably nutsedge.
> Nutsedge will normally grow significantly faster than any fescue so that
> halfway between your normal mowing interval you have perhaps 4 to 6 inch
> blades towing over your slower growing fescue. There is a product called
> Manage that does an excellent job of controlling this weed grass. Mix per
> directions and wait until about 4 days after you mow (long enough to give
> the nutsedge time to grow much taller than your fescue). Use a pump up
> sprayer and add a "sticker" (a type of detergent that breaks the surface
> tension of the water and makes it coat the leaves more effectively). I
> normally use a table spoon of High Yield Sticker (High Yield is a brand)
> in a gallon of water with a 1 gallon packet of Manage. Coat the nutsedge
> leave throughly but do not drench the dwarf fescue around it too much. If
> you get a lot of Manage on your fescue it will brown it out (but it will
> normally come back).
>
> Good luck
>
> BTW, here are some pictures of various kinds of nutsedge:
>
> http://weeds.ippc.orst.edu/pnw/weeds?weeds/id/Yellow_nutsedg e--Cyperus_esculentus--s.html
>
> http://www.oisat.org/pests/weeds/sedges/nutsedge.html
>
> http://www.agf.gov.bc.ca/cropprot/weedguid/purplent.htm
>
> http://weeds.ippc.orst.edu/pnw/weeds?weeds/id/Purple_nutsedg e--Cyperus_rotundus--m.html

I got it. I just replied to the other message before I read yours.


"John Crichton" <crichton [at] moya.org> wrote in message
news:5WOUe.343205$xm3.259424 [at] attbi_s21...
>
>
> G Burton wrote:
>
>> I fear you might be right, but I not willing to whack the whole lawn
>> at this time.
>>
>> I actually went to the agricultural station some time and they
>> couldn't identify the grass. They said they could only identify it by
>> the seed head, and I didn't bring that in. I may have to get me a seed
>> head and go back, but they did tell me that selective poisons for grasses
>> don't work very well. I guess crabgrass is one of the rare exceptions to
>> that.
>>
>> <trader4 [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
>> news:1126406102.711207.180160 [at] f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>>" What if I stop using Roundup and just overseed the "bad" areas
>>>like crazy with new dwarf fescue, and mow at about 2 and 1/2 inches. I
>>>am
>>>thinking the thick Fescue would eventually choke out the ugly grass --
>>>
>>>especially if I mow a little shorter, which the Fescue would tollerate
>>>better than the ugly grass, which is taller. "
>>>
>>>That's unlikely to work. You have some kind of coarse, faster growing
>>>grass. A slow growing dwarf fescue isn't likely to be able to drive
>>>that out. I'd take a sample of it to an agricultural extension service
>>>that many states have. If you can identify it, there may be an agent
>>>that can selectively eliminate it. Otherwise, if you have a lot of it,
>>>I'd use Roundup to whack the bad areas all at once, then over seed the
>>>whole lawn. If it really is everywhere, and there is nothing that will
>>>selectively treat it, then you may need to whackthe whole lawn
>>>
>>
>>
>
> Maybe I wasn't clear. Manage will control nutsedge with little or no
> damage to your fescue.
>

" I can't tell from the pictures if I have Nutsedge or not. I will
wait
until I get a seedhead and take it to my nursery. "

You may be waiting a long time. Nutsedge is a tuber, so it doesn't
produce a seed head. One way to identify nutsedge is by when it
grows. It only becomes a problem when it's hot and there is a lot of
water present. Then when you mow the lawn, a couple days later you
will see blades sticking up a lot higher than the grass.

On 11 Sep 2005 04:05:16 -0700, trader4 [at] optonline.net wrote:

>" I can't tell from the pictures if I have Nutsedge or not. I will
>wait
>until I get a seedhead and take it to my nursery. "
>
>You may be waiting a long time. Nutsedge is a tuber, so it doesn't
>produce a seed head. One way to identify nutsedge is by when it
>grows. It only becomes a problem when it's hot and there is a lot of
>water present. Then when you mow the lawn, a couple days later you
>will see blades sticking up a lot higher than the grass.

Nutsedge HAS a seed head
http://www.rce.rutgers.edu/weeds/full.asp?nutsedge



Acts of creation are ordinarily reserved for gods and poets. To plant a pine, one need only own a shovel.
-- Aldo Leopold

Please don't respond to any of my postings or postings by others who
reply to my postings.

I had a posting named "Dry spots in the lawn", to which you responded.
I appreciated your help at first, although it later turned out that you were
wrong about some major points. With no one making an issue of your
mistakes, you disagreed with some people who were correct. You wound up
calling one of the people (who did give me good information) an idiot.
Later you posted to the group that I wasn't smart enough to understand good
solutions. It was an active conversation with a lot of good ideas (except
yours) and no one else dropped to that level. We don't need that stuff.

"Tom Jaszewski" <tomxxx [at] livesoil.com> wrote in message
news:cng8i1l7vame947b0u2ahb0nqkiov4uguu [at] 4ax.com...
> On 11 Sep 2005 04:05:16 -0700, trader4 [at] optonline.net wrote:
>
>>" I can't tell from the pictures if I have Nutsedge or not. I will
>>wait
>>until I get a seedhead and take it to my nursery. "
>>
>>You may be waiting a long time. Nutsedge is a tuber, so it doesn't
>>produce a seed head. One way to identify nutsedge is by when it
>>grows. It only becomes a problem when it's hot and there is a lot of
>>water present. Then when you mow the lawn, a couple days later you
>>will see blades sticking up a lot higher than the grass.
>
> Nutsedge HAS a seed head
> http://www.rce.rutgers.edu/weeds/full.asp?nutsedge
>
>
>
> Acts of creation are ordinarily reserved for gods and poets. To plant a
> pine, one need only own a shovel.
> -- Aldo Leopold

On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 09:19:18 -0700, "G Burton"
<burton.garyNOSPAM [at] comcast.net> wrote:

>We

firstly you are not the spokes person for this list, secondly I was
not wrong, and you don't listen, thirdly nutsedge does have a seed
head and any other opinion is fantasy and misinformation, which you
seem to thrive on.....



Acts of creation are ordinarily reserved for gods and poets. To plant a pine, one need only own a shovel.
-- Aldo Leopold

Tom Jewski wrote:

>
>
> firstly you are not the spokes person for this list, secondly I was
> not wrong, and you don't listen, thirdly nutsedge does have a seed
> head and any other opinion is fantasy and misinformation, which you
> seem to thrive on.....
>


The only 'nuts' you thrive on are in the nutsacks of your male friends.
FOAD lib-tard.

"Nutsedge HAS a seed head
http://www.rce.rutgers.edu/weeds/full.asp?nutsedge "

Thanks for pointing that out. You are correct. I thought it
reproduced only via tubers. I guess I always mowed or got rid of any I
saw before they got to the seed point.

On 10 Sep 2005 19:35:02 -0700, trader4 [at] optonline.net wrote:

>A slow growing dwarf fescue


I thought I read that dwarf indicated height at seed head not growth
rate?



Acts of creation are ordinarily reserved for gods and poets. To plant a pine, one need only own a shovel.
-- Aldo Leopold

I'm hoping someone is still following this, because I finally got some
new information.

I finally had the ugly grass identified by someone who seems to know his
stuff. He said it's "wild fescue". He also said there isn't much I can do
about it (since the lawn I am trying to maintain is dwarf fescue) except
what I have been doing, which is to hit the worst spots with Roundup and
reseed.

He's probably right; but if anyone has any different ideas, I would like
to read them.